Patrilineal Descent

Question: In a system of patrilineal descent? a.)kin are connected to the father's line B.) kin are connected through only the mothers line C.) descent and inheritance are linked equally to both partners D.) maternal grandparents are more important than paternal grandparents

Answer: WhAt does "pAtrilineAl' mean? As A hint, it is the opposite of "mAtrilineAl". Everything flows through the fAther's line. And I think I gAve you enough clues.

Question: Patrilineal Descent Question? Who are you related to in this sense going back from great grandparents? Would you be related to your siblings, father's parents, father's siblings, etc? What would you be related to? Could you make a separate list for the maternal side just using the titles like related to mother's parents, etc?? Thanks

Answer: What was wrong with the last answer I gave you? http://au.answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=ArlCHsE1dHCCleDQIEFz1sXg5gt.;_ylv=3?qid=20100527111119AAU7sMO All those people I listed (great-grand parents, grand-parents, parents as well as siblings, aunts, uncles, cousins and all of these once-, first- and twice- removed and so on) are people you are related to. I don't know how else to explain. The titles are **exactly the same** on your mother's side as on your father's side. Your mother's mother is called your grandmother and your father's mother is also called your grandmother. Your mother's sister is called your aunt and so is your father's sister. The labels don't change depending on what side of the family you're talking about.

Question: Does the religion Islam believe in patrilineal descent? Is it true that someone is a Muslim if their father is (or was)? So technically, Senator Obama is a Muslim?

Answer: As I understand it, Muslims believe that everyone is born Muslim, regardless of the faith of their parents. I suppose that would technically make every non-Muslim an apostate from a Muslim point of view. Traditional Judaism uses matrilineal descent to determine Jewish status, but uses patrilineal descent for everything else. I can't think of any other religion that claims a baby is born with a specific faith. Obama claims Christianity as his religion, and denies ever having been a Muslim. So from a Muslim viewpoint, Obama has renounced Islam, and is no longer a Muslim.

Question: If David was a descendant of Ruth (a Moab convert) , why the belief in patrilineal descent for the Messiah? Do Jews realize that the Messiah is dependent on Gentiles? Do Jews admit that without Gentiles Israel has no future? Do Jews realize that David was the descendant of a Gentile convert?

Answer: Yes, David was a descendant of Ruth, but he was also a Levite. Levites are of patrilineal descent. Yes, we realize that our future depends upon conversions -- someone periodically destroys half of our population. Yes, we know that David descended from a convert, in fact we celebrate it each year. I think the holiday is Shavu'ot. We don't need to bother keeping track of the line of David. We will know the messiah because he will be the King (human) of Israel when there is peace on earth. You ask great questions! .

Question: Why does Jewish identity pass through the mother (matrilineal descent) if the Tanakh traces descent by fathers? I know that Karaite Jews (a tiny minority) say that "if your father is a Jew, then you are a Jew" because the Tanakh records descent in a patrilineal manner. Why do the Rabbinic Jews recognize matrilineal descent?

Answer: Mary's answer is plausible. ===== One approah is that the reason is Historical. "Judaism introduced matrilineal descent somewhere in the period of the Second Temple and the Roman occupation according to Prof. Shaye Cohen, now at Harvard..." "I recall that it was less the issue of being certain of the father's identity than it was to bring Jewish law into somewhat coherence with Roman law regarding "citizenship" and "nationality" and rights and privileges within society..." ( http://judaism.about.com/library/3_askrabbi_c/bl_matri_descent.htm and see also http://www.myjewishlearning.com/ask_the_expert/at/AsktheExpert--Matrilineal_descent.shtml ) "This practice may have originated in the period of Ezra (Ezra 10 3; Neh. 13.23 ff) and may parallel that of Pericles of Athens who sought to limit citizenship to descendants of Athenian mothers. It may also have represented temporary, emergency legislation of that period." ( http://data.ccarnet.org/cgi-bin/respdisp.pl?file=38&year=carr ) ===== There are also those who proclaim that Jewish ID was always passed through the mother, even in Biblical periods. They say that there are allusions to matrilineal descent in Tanakh. ("This began with the giving of the Torah and is rooted in the law in Deuteronomy." - http://www.askmoses.com/en/article/174,2063982/Why-is-a-childs-Judaism-determined-by-the-mother.html ) "Leviticus 24:10 speaks of the son of an Israelite woman and an Egyptian man as being "among the community of Israel" (i.e., a Jew). On the other hand, in Ezra 10:2-3, the Jews returning to Israel vowed to put aside their non-Jewish wives and the children born to those wives. They could not have put aside those children if those children were Jews." ( http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Judaism/whojew1.html and http://www.jewfaq.org/whoisjew.htm#Matrilineal ) "The Mishnah (Kiddushin 3:12) states that, to be a Jew, one must be either the child of a Jewish mother or a convert to Judaism. The Talmud (Kiddushin 68b) derives this law from the Torah. The relevant Torah passage (Deut. 7:3-4) reads: "Thy daughter thou shalt not give to his son, nor shalt thou take his daughter to thy son. For they will turn away thy son from following me, that they may serve other gods." " ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matrilineality#Judaism ) See also http://www.faqs.org/faqs/judaism/FAQ/05-Worship/section-35.html and ======== "Matrilineal descent, although generally accepted for the union of a Jew and a non-Jew, has rested on an uncertain basis. Some have deduced it from Deuteronomy 7.4, others from Ezra 9 and 10. Still others feel that the dominant influence of the mother during the formative years accounted for this principle. A few modern scholars felt that the rabbinic statement followed the Roman Paulus (Digest 2.4 f), who stated that the maternity was always known while paternity was doubtful; this, however, could be extended to the offspring of any parents. Shaye Cohen has also suggested that the rabbis may have abhorred this type of mixture of people as they felt negatively toward mixtures of animals and materials. A full discussion of this and other material may be found in Aptowtizer's "Spuren des Matriarchats im jüdischen Schriftum," Hebrew Union College Annual, Vols. 4 and 5 and Shaye J. D. Cohen's "The Origin of the Matrilineal Principle in Rabbinic Law," Judaism, Winter, 1984." ( http://data.ccarnet.org/cgi-bin/respdisp.pl?file=38&year=carr ) ======= There are some who give "spiritual" reasons for this law. For example, see http://www.israelnationalnews.com/Articles/Article.aspx/9005 and http://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/601092/jewish/Why-is-Jewishness-matrilineal.htm But I don't think that's what you were looking for. (See also http://lhaim.blogspot.com/2006/11/why-is-being-jewish-determined-by.html ) ==== See http://www.oztorah.com/2009/07/matrilineality-is-still-best-for-jewish-identity/ and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matrilineality_in_Judaism for a discussion of this issue. ====== There are two academic works that touch on this topic: "Who Was a Jew?: Rabbinic and Halakhic Perspectives on the Jewish Christian Schism" by Lawrence H. Schiffman "The Beginnings of Jewishness: Boundaries, Varieties, Uncertainties" by Shaye Cohen

Question: Which of the following statements concerning leadership in Mongol society is most correct? A. Leaders were drawn from the scholar-gentry class. B. The mongols recognized two royal families, and all leaders were the oldest males of the lineages. C. Mongols leadership was based on patrilineal descent from the Kuriltai tribe D. Mongols often recognized the leadership of females who traced their descent from female deities. E. Leaders were elected by free males and held office for as long as they could keep it.

Answer: Not sure about this, i guess c

Question: How do you know if you are Jew or Gentile? In the thousands of years since Biblical times, people have been converted to other religions for various reasons and have practiced them for centuries. How can anybody say for certain whether they are or are not a member of one of the 12 tribes of Israel? The bible emphasizes patrilineal descent, not matrilineal, which the Judaism follows which is contrary to Mosaic law.

Answer: That depends on when you ask the question. We know King David’s lineage includes women like Tamar, Rahab and Ruth but there is no scriptural evidence that Rahab or Ruth converted. We do NOT know if David's Mom’s was Jewish because all SCRIPTURAL lineage determined by the FATHER's lineage as the Torah instructed. If you were to ask the Jews who made up the Talmud after the men were killed, women raped, and all the records of lineage destroyed, then you would follow the MOTHER's lineage. Of course, then you also get the answer from Jews who will give a hybrid answer: "***Judaism is not a faith, it is a nationality. You are a Jew not because you 'believe' in Judaism, you are a Jew because your mother was a Jew. Whether you 'believe' or not does not matter as far as your membership is concerned. The only ones who have to 'believe' are converts." ….but name another government that said it existed for about 2000 years without a land or a formal government.***” Face it, Jews don’t agree on what makes a Jew a Jew so how can you? Jews are as different as Dr. Laura is from Barbara Streisand about everything. But each will answer as if all Jews everywhere hold the same position as the Jew with whom you are speaking. As demonstrated here, today's Jews say your mother determines your being a Jew. However, later in the same conversation they will tell you that if you believe in Jesus, you are no longer a Jew. Only a Jew would think it make sense to say, “Your mother’s lineage was all important and not your faith in determining if you are a Jew. ….until you expressed a faith in Jesus which renders your mother’s lineage meaningless and your faith all important.” They can’t/won’t attempt to explain how faith in Judaism is NOT AT ALL important in determining whether you are a Jew but faith in Jesus IS ALL important in determining you aren’t a Jew. This is just one of many inconsistencies. Many will say they are “Torah observant” and celebrate Hanukkah. They will tell you it was by G-d’s provision that Israel returned her land and fought back two Muslim surprise attacks. However, even the most "Torah observant" Jews ignores what the Torah says about the Temple being the central place of Jewish worship, making sacrifices for the sins of Israel and the individuals, and the offerings made at the Holy of holies. It does not matter that the restoration to G-d included rebuilding the 2nd Temple according to the scriptures. Nor does it matter that the first Hanukkah was celebrated after cleansing/restoration of the Temple from Gentile occupancy. Apparently, Judaism is more united about not believing in Jesus than believing anything the Torah says. Jews will say the covenant of Abraham was extended to all of Israel. However, they don’t want to explain how the northern kingdom is part of that covenant since it disappeared 2,500 years ago....or how they determined you aren’t a part of the northern kingdom since proving your lineage is not part of northern kingdom is as impossible as proving their lineage is pure given their history of persecution, no records of lineage for thousands of years and refusal to base Judaism on DNA testing. Expect everything you and I say to be wrong and know it is easier to play the anti-Semitic card than to give a reasonable explanation. Don’t expect scriptural answers unless you equate the Talmud with the Torah....and expect them to tell you the Torah is greater than the Talmud. So make sure you ask several Jews what they believe before making any conclusions on Judaism. Hope this helps

Question: can you guys help me with these anthropology questions? If you belong to a publicly recognized social entity by virtue of being a lineal descendant of a particular ancestor, you are a member of a ____. a.) descent group b.)lineage c.)clan d.)moiety e.)phratry In a(n) ____ descent group, membership is traced either through males or through females but not both. a.)matrilineal b.)patrilineal c.)unilineal d.)double e.)ambilineal ____ kinship affiliates a person with close relatives through both sexes; in other words, the individual traces descent through both parents, all four grandparents, and so forth, recognizing multiple ancestors. a.)Bilateral descent b.)Ambilineal descent c.)Bilateral kinship d.)Unilineal descent e.)Double descent Patrilineal descent is likely to be found in societies where ____. a.)women are breadwinners b.)male labor is a prime factor c.)horticulture is done primarily by women d.)pastoralism and intensive agriculture are practiced e.)b and d In what country do we find the Maori people? a.)Canada b.)United States c.)Kenya d.)Australia e.)New Zealand Matrilineal descent groups are associated with farming societies in which ____ are the breadwinners. a.)men b.)women c.)children d.)outsiders e.)grandfathers twice removed A boy is born into a society that practices matrilineal descent. The person who exercises authority over him is ____. a.)his sister b.)his father c.)his mother d.)his mother's brother e.)his father's sister A young man of Jewish affiliation moves to New York City to find a job. He calls everyone he knows of from both his mother's and father's side of the family, and attends various meetings to which he is invited by virtue of his being related to various ancestors on both his parents' side. These groups support him when he runs out of money and help him find an apartment and a job. We can say that he is a member of a(n) ____ descent group. a.)matrilineal b.)patrilineal c.)ambilineal d.)double e.)cognatic A ____ is a noncorporate descent group whose members claim descent from a common ancestor but cannot trace their genealogical links to that ancestor. a.)family b.)totem c.)clan d.)kindred e.)lineage A clan is similar to a lineage except that ____. a.)a clan has fewer people b/)clan members are unable to trace exact genealogical links to their common ancestor c.)clans are more likely to hold tangible property corporately d.)clans are exogamous whereas lineages are endogamous e.)clans are patrilocal whereas lineages are matrilocal

Answer: c c a b ? b c e c b

Question: What happens when 2 individuals with hyphenated last names get married, last name wise? As you know, it just to be tradition that the bride would take the groom's last name at marriage, and or if they both kept their own last names at marriage, the children of a couple would adopt the fathers last name (traditionally; in the past). Obviously not in all cases (that's NOT what I'm trying to say), but in most. However, relatively recently, it's now getting more common for the bride & groom to keep their own last names, and to hypenate their childrens last name. But, what happens when 2 individuals, both with hyphenated last names, get married? If the parents decide to keep their last names, and assuming they have children, what is the tradition now? What is common now? What is expected now? Ex: 2 individuals getting married (fictional): Susan Smith-Johnson & Tom Hay-Dobson. Both keep their own last names upon marriage. They have 2 children, Kelly and Brian. Would it be expected/traditional (in general) that the children each have four last names (i.e. Kelly Smith-Johnson-Hay-Dobson & Brian Smith-Johnson-Hay-Dobson)? Or, if not, what would be expected? If it's becoming more common for children NOT to have the father's last name(s), it therefore would be contradictory to the current trend if both children became "Hay-Dobson", yet, having 4 last names is just ridiculous! What do you think? Do you know what is commonly occuring now a days in terms of issues such as this, and the way we are moving away from patrilineal descent in terms of taking the male's (in marriage) or father's ( in having children) last names?

Answer: I would like to think that nobody would be that inconsiderate to their children and give them a quadruple-barreled last name. Maybe they would take their dad's surname, or a combination of the two surnames if it is important to both parents. Maybe another one or two of the names could be included as middle names. Not sure, that is what I guess would happen.

Question: The system of descent in the U.S. may be said to be? a. patrilineal. b. matrilineal. c. parilateral. d. bilineal.

Answer: please do your own homework

Question: In Orthodox Judaism: can you prove jesus was and is and will never be the messiah through Tanach? "messiah" i.e. I'm talking about one particular Jew, who will come from Shevet Yehuda (Tribe of Yehuda), through patrilineal (father to father) descent, and through the line of Dovid Hamelech (King David). Also, please be generous in naming sources, websites, articles in magazines, forums, thanks! Furthermore, please do not quote from the NT(New Testament) as this(NT) is not held as binding and is a foreign concept partially in Judaism. PLEASE NOTE: I am not Jewish, so take it easy on me!:D As a side note do try to use the original language i.e. Hebrew in trying to prove your point(s).

Answer: The others have given you specific prophecies that Jesus failed to fulfill and links to some great sites- just a few comments on the so called fulfillment of the prophecies posted by "bride of sukkels" aka as duplicate account of sukkels "The Sanhedrin will be re-established (Isaiah 1:26) It was by Christ and His decipels." No- the Sanhedrin were the Pharisees that the Christian scriptures spend so mmuch time lying about and trying to malign. Jesus and his disciples were never even Judges let alone Judges n the Sanhedrin. PLus- awfully difficult to re-establish something that is already there! "* Once he is King, leaders of other nations will look to him for guidance. (Isaiah 2:4) #That is true to this day. From the Roman empire to the USA." Wrong- Christianity does not rule the world- in fact we live in a world where the bulk of countries have laws specifically separating the powers of Church and State- and in fact the majority of countries where there is theological rule are Islamic- the one exception being Vatican State "* The whole world will worship the One God of Israel (Isaiah 2:17) #Again, true. The whole world does worship the God of Israel. Not everyone does however." It does but people don't? You always speak in opposites? As for the whole world worshipping G-d: theres Hindus, Shinotoists, Atheists, various Pagan paths etc. the whole world is very far from worshipping G-d! "* He will be descended from King David (Isaiah 11:1) via King Solomon (1 Chron. 22:8-10) #Yup and yes." Nope- if G-d is his father by definition he is not a member of any tribe. Feel free to try and find anywhere in Jewish law that an adopted child becomes part of the tribe of the adopted father. "* The Moshiach will be a man of this world, an observant Jew with "fear of God" (Isaiah 11:2) #That describes Jesus to the letter." No, the Christina scriptures give an explicit description of him breaking the laws of Shabbos by telling his followers to pick barley on Shabbos. On top of that he failed to perform the mitzvah of p'ru u'revu "*****In other words - this must all be accomplished in a human lifetime***** #It was accomplished by Jesus in the period of His lifetime." Nothing was accomplished by Jesus except to die in a painful and gruesome way at the hand sof the Romans "* Evil and tyranny will not be able to stand before his leadership (Isaiah 11:4) #That's right. No evil and no tyranny will He not right on judgment day." Plenty of evil and tyranny in the world- judgement day happens when the Messiah is alive- not when he is dead! "* Knowledge of God will fill the world (Isaiah 11:9) #Absolutely. The world is filled with the knowledge of God, but not everyone accepts it. But they Know who He is." Rubbish- Hindus, Shintoists, Animists, Pagans, Atheists etc all reject G-d. Knowledge of G-d means ACCEPTANCE of G-d, not just knowing that a word exists! "* He will include and attract people from all cultures and nations (Isaiah 11:10) #UH,,,, Yeah! There are Christian Arabs all the way to Christian Zulus. A-Z" Rubbish- Hindus, Shintoists, Animists, Pagans, Atheists etc all reject Jesus- as do the Jews. "* All Israelites will be returned to their homeland (Isaiah 11:12) #Yup again. Israel was re-established as a nation in 1948 and 10's of thousands of Jews continue to migrate there each year. ." At the time of Jesus the majority of Jews lived outside of Israel- he did not gathe rthem up. The Jews are all meant to return to Israel during the lifetime of the Messiah- if he dies, he is not the Messiah! "* Death will be swallowed up forever (Isaiah 25:8) #Yup again. If you believe in Jesus, you will never die. Eternal life is yours." Pity for you that the prophecies refers to the resurrection of the dead on THIS WORLD. Nice try at reinterpretation to explain his failures though, "* There will be no more hunger or illness, and death will cease (Isaiah 25:8) #When Jesus returns as He promised, these things will be fulfilled." The Mashiach does everything in ONE lifetime. There is no support in the Tanakh anywhere that the Mashiach dies beforw he fulfills what he is supposed to do. A second coming is something inserted by Christian scriptures to make an excuse for Jesus not fulfilling the necessary prophecies. "* All of the dead will rise again (Isaiah 26:19) #Ditto. Promised again." The Mashiach does everything in ONE lifetime. There is no support in the Tanakh anywhere that the Mashiach dies beforw he fulfills what he is supposed to do. A second coming is something inserted by Christian scriptures to make an excuse for Jesus not fulfilling the necessary prophecies. "* The Jewish people will experience eternal joy and gladness (Isaiah 51:11) #Yes they will, when their knee bends and their lips say Jesus is Lord." The Mashiach does everything in ONE lifetime. There is no support in the Tanakh anywhere that the Mashiach dies beforw he fulfills what he

Question: Christians: A question regarding the gospel genealogies quoted for Jesus? In the gospels, two separate genealogies are given for Jesus. One, the patrilineal line through Joseph; the second, the matrilineal line through Mary. As I understand it, a matrilineal line was an exceptional one for Jews at that time to have constructed let alone accepted. So, why two lines of descent from King David? Was this a reflection of the paternity situation with respect to Joseph? (If so, of course, why would it have been quoted by one of the gospel writers in the first place?) And second, would a matrilineal line to King David have been acceptable to Jews of that period as justification for Jesus's messianic claim? W r y: Yes, Karen Armstrong in her writing makes this point, and argues that John the Baptist *was* and so perhaps he and Jesus had originally planned to work together. An interesting though not wholly convincing theory. Avondrow: I agree, though not with the 'independently' element. I suspect that the later writer realised that a line through Joseph was a suspect one given that Joseph was no blood relative to Jesus.

Answer: The genealogies in Matthew and Luke are not intended to present a factual famiily tree. Rather, they are artificial constructions with a theological aim, and may have been adapted from earlier Jewish messianic genealogies. A remarkable feature in Matthew's genealogy is his introduction of four women (Tamar, Rahab, Ruth, and Mary). The purpose of this is to demonstrate the precedent in God's plan for the role of Mary, who appears as Jesus' mother at the end of the genealogy. In Luke's genealogy, several of the names that appear for the period after the Babylonian exile, such as Levi and Mattathias, imply descent from the Israelite priestly house of Levi (the Levites) rather than the royal house of David. According to Julius Africanus (around 220 CE), some people saw this feature as highly significant and held that while Matthew's genealogy asserted Jesus' royal descent, Luke emphasised his levitical, priestly, lineage. It is unlikely, on closer analysis, that the genealogies can really be distinguished in this way. Interestingly, however, Luke presents Elizabeth, the mother of John the Baptist, as a woman of priestly stock, descended from Aaron (Luke 1:5). Mary is Elizabeth's kinswoman, so this could perhaps be taken as indicating that Jesus was of levitical descent on his mother's side. Curiously, in Luke, Jesus is said to be descended from King David not through the famous King Solomon but through another son, Nathan. Luke may have confused this Nathan with Solomon's contemporary, Nathan the prophet, because the evangelist intended to introduce a prophetic element into Jesus' background. Or Luke may have wanted to avoid referring to Jehoiakim and Jehoiachin, the last two legitimate kings of Judah, because of a prophecy in the book of Jeremiah that they would have no descendants.

Question: Patrilineal Descent Question? Who are you related to in this sense going back from great grandparents? Could you list them? ie: Father, father's sister, etc. What about matrilineal? thanks

Answer: Biologically, you have 2 parents. 4 grand-parents (your parents' parents - 2 each = 2x2 = 4) 8 great-grand-parents (your grand-parents' parents - 2 each = 4x2 = 8) And so on. Your parents' brothers and sisters are your aunts and uncles Your grand-parents' brothers and sisters are your grand-aunts and grand-uncles Your great-grand-parents' brothers and sisters are your great-grand-aunts and great-grand-uncles. And so on. Your aunts' and uncles' children are your first-cousins. Your first cousins' children are your second-cousins. Your grand-aunts' and grand-uncles' children are your first-cousins once removed. Your second-cousins' children are your second-cousins once-removed. Siblings have the same parents. Cousins have the same grand-parents. Second-cousins have the same great-grand parents. And so on. Once-removed is one generation away. Twice removed is two generations away. All of this is on both your mother's side and your father's side. And all of these people are related to you. "And so on" is pretty broad. We're all related to each other eventually ;-)

Question: Do you have to be Jewish to join the IDF? For someone who is not of Jewish descent along Patrilineal or Matrilineal lines, is it possible to join any arm of the Israeli Defence Forces?

Answer: No. You do not have to be Jewish to join the IDF. You do have to be Israeli. All citizens of Israel are required to join the IDF when they turn 18. There are loopholes to this such as medical, religious, and study. (although with study you are usually required to join AFTER your studies). Another law is that Arabs CAN join if they want but are not required to join. This rule is in place so that Arabs do not have to fight against their "brothers" due to the conflict we have in this region. Despite this, many Arabs choose to join the IDF. And recently (within the past 6 months i think) a Muslim soldier was killed when he stepped on a land mine and then fell off the rescue rope from the helicopter. Druze soldiers are famous for their expertise in tracking and border patrol. They often get into elite units in the army. The IDF accepts ALL of its citizens into the army whether they be Jewish, Christian, Muslim, Druze, etc. But like I said, not all of them have to join, but for the majority of the population, army service is compulsory.

Question: Do you have to be Jewish to join the IDF? For someone who is not of Jewish descent along Patrilineal or Matrilineal lines, is it possible to join any arm of the Israeli Defence Forces?

Answer: I think you have to be a citizen of Israel to "join" (service mandatory)...and you have to be Jewish to be a citizen.

Question: What happens when 2 individuals with hyphenated last names get married, last name wise? As you know, it just to be tradition that the bride would take the groom's last name at marriage, and or if they both kept their own last names at marriage, the children of a couple would adopt the fathers last name (traditionally; in the past). Obviously not in all cases (that's NOT what I'm trying to say), but in most. However, relatively recently, it's now getting more common for the bride & groom to keep their own last names, and to hypenate their childrens last name. But, what happens when 2 individuals, both with hyphenated last names, get married? If the parents decide to keep their last names, and assuming they have children, what is the tradition now? What is common now? What is expected now? Ex: 2 individuals getting married (fictional): Susan Smith-Johnson & Tom Hay-Dobson. Both keep their own last names upon marriage. They have 2 children, Kelly and Brian. Would it be expected/traditional (in general) that the children each have four last names (i.e. Kelly Smith-Johnson-Hay-Dobson & Brian Smith-Johnson-Hay-Dobson)? Or, if not, what would be expected? If it's becoming more common for children NOT to have the father's last name(s), it therefore would be contradictory to the current trend if both children became "Hay-Dobson", yet, having 4 last names is just ridiculous! What do you think? Do you know what is commonly occuring now a days in terms of issues such as this, and the way we are moving away from patrilineal descent in terms of taking the male's (in marriage) or father's ( in having children) last names Only a question for curiosity. I'm not asking if the bride would take the husband's last name. I already stated both individuals said they would keep THEIR OWN last names; thus, no one would change their last name.

Answer: i'll make this simple for you. say the 1st part of the couple's name is the father's name and the 2nd part is the mother's name. Okay, here goes. Their children would be Kelly and Brian Johnson-Hay. Let me explain. If a woman is passing on her name, she passes on the 2nd name. If a man is passing on his name, he passes down the 1st part of the name. Get it? And the cycle continues. Brian marries Sue Smith-Jones, so their kid's name will be Jane Johnson-Jones. To me, this sounds like a logical approach. It's kind of like the way they do it in Spain.I'm sure there are other alternatives. I'm all for hyphenation (since I'm carrying the baby darnit).